Aminet 22/Aminet 22 (1997)(GTI - Schatztruhe)[!][Dec 1997].iso/Aminet/game/hint/playstat.lha/WH

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 WARHAMMER - SHADOW OF THE HORN RAT
 ==================================

Update on the items in the three unwinnable missions (Loren too early):

You can steal them by rushing for them and then retreating or even
by surrendering the mission.


Protect Schnappleburg --------------------------------------------------
Sword of Might          - Between trees in north east of deployment zone
                          and road (west of road).

Capture Otto Hiln ------------------------------------------------------
Dragon Blade            - In the snowman behind the house at the
                          northeast corner of the map.

Rescue Ilmarin ---------------------------------------------------------
Shield of Pthlos        - Behind the trees on the western edge of the
                          map.

Slave Train ------------------------------------------------------------
Sword of Heroes         - in the cemetery right next to the chapel in
                          the north east.

Shattered Pass ---------------------------------------------------------
Potion of Strength      - north of the deployment area in the north east
                          corner of the cliff.

Squatter's Rights ------------------------------------------------------
Talisman of Obsidian    - near house on middle right side

Surprise Attack --------------------------------------------------------
Potion of Strength      - at the east side of the map aginst the
                          mountain
Banner of Arcane Warding- at a rock to the upper west

Rat Trap ---------------------------------------------------------------
+1 Chain Mail Armour    - after winning the mission units with armour
                          below 2 get it

Slave assault ----------------------------------------------------------
Banner of Might         - at rocks north of deployment area

Bandit Hideout ---------------------------------------------------------
Armour of Meteoric Iron - west of the camp by some trees.

Extermination ----------------------------------------------------------
Banner of Dread         - lower right corner of the battlefield

Skaven Tunnels ---------------------------------------------------------
Potion of Strength      - near two rocks in the centre of the map
Banner of Arcane Protection
                        - northwest of deployment zone

Troll Valley -----------------------------------------------------------
Potion of Strength      - in the east near the lava falls
Banner of Wrath         - in the west near the 3 lava pools

First ambush of Loren patrol mission -----------------------------------
Sword of Parrying       - ???

========================================================================

How to get to the "Counterattack" mission

This might or might not be a secret mission, it might be a little known
mission. Anyway, it is called Counterattack and to get it, first try at
least one of the three unwinnable Loren missions.  After that chose the
select, but instead of selecting one, return to the caravan and then
select mission again you will then be able to chose the Counterattack
mission. You might need to get the Zufbar mission briefing first.


HERE ARE THE MISSION STRATEGY TIPS:

I have been playing this game off and on for a week now and have made
several observations about what strategies work and don't work.  Others
who have thoughts or ideas are welcome to follow this thread.

1. In missions where you have the option to choose and place units,
especially later in the game, use a line of archers backed by morters
to kill large groups and numbers of the enemy.  In the dwarve missions,
such as Skaven Slaves, I have used a a line archers, Mercenary
Crossbows - Holgars Crossbows (Leitdorff) - Dwarve Crossbows, backed by
morters to eliminate everything which comes my way.  Hence this rule:
The best assault is a defensive one. Make the enemy come to you.

2. Always back up your morters and archers etc. with infantry and
cavalry - just in case.

3. Never place two morters in close proximity side by side as this
often leads to the explosion of one of them and the partial death of
the crew (possible bug?).

4. Allor should never be placed behind your lines or he will kill your
guys with a hunting spear.  Allor isn't bright this way, so place him
out front or on a flank and cover him with infantry or Cav.

5. When faced with large numbers of charging skaven or otherwise,
always use morters and crossbows/bows on the fastest moving groups.
Look for choke points and hit the units passing through these areas
with artillery or projectile weapons.  Use the curse and tangle thorn
spells liberally in these situations.

6. Always switch targets when you decimate a group of the enemy.  Never
just keep shooting at the same group, switch to another one, you can
mop up later and the group you don't hit will inevitably breach your
line.

7. When faced with a choice between shooting at a monster or oncoming
infantry units, hit the monster.  The monster will require time to kill
and will cause your units to flee.

8. In the dwarve missions when you are in a fortress or tunnels,
advance with caution. Be wary of the situation where the shooting has
stopped and nothing is alive out in front of you, but the mission still
is going.  This generally means that one of your units must advance and
trip a flag which will cause more of the enemy to appear.  For these
situations, use cavalry. They can run if outnumbered.

9. When taking on enemy artillery always use infantry and try to avoid
the straight on attack, it gives too much time to the enemy to get the
yardage right.  Also, if you are being fired on, close with the enemy,
he usually avoids shooting his own and this can buy time.

10. Anybody ever kill the dragon in the dwarf missions?  Use it to kill
the enemy (hint).

11. Always survey the battlefield prior to the start of a mission to
grasp how many and what is around.  Look for magic items to get later.

12. Use terrian to your advantage.  If you are on a hill it will take
time to get to you, just as in real life.  Archers/crossbows shooting
down hill are deadly in these cases. For the same reasons, get the heck
out of valleys.

13. It is possible to finish this game without editing the save game
files.  This practice is risky and so far has not been explained well
in this group.  I have tried this but have given it up for a more
purist approach and have found that I can make it.  You just have to be
prepared think out what the best way to achieve a victory is.  This is
a hard game, and you have to be fast in your decisions and have a loose
plan that makes sense before you start a mission.


Save Carlson's Family ==================================================
---------------------
Ceridan and the mage on the far left
crossbowmen in the middle rear
gb cav center
gb inf right center
black avengers far right

My first move was to charge the units flanking the dwarves with the GB
cav to relieve them.  I charge ceridan at the biguns to the far left as
a delaying tactic and allor casts curse on em, then spears em until
they break (luck!) I focus the crossbows on the biguns at first and
then move on to the unit behind them, depending on opportunity.

The black avengers move up the left side of the screen and attempt to
engage units moving to attack the gb cav which by now is probably
running down its first opponent.  The gb inf you should hold back until
you get a flank shot at something good.

The battle rages on for a while and if you are fortunate, the dwarves
who are now relieved of the pressure of an enemy on their flank kick
some serious ass and orc units start shattering.  I recommend holding
the hero button on the GB cav and using grudge bringer as often as
possible.  You need those orcs to break fast.

The challenge on the left side is that you have to keep allor alive
which means that he may have to retreat and be relieved by the
crossbowmen who you may have to engage the remainders of biguns
(hopefully not) or the orcs behind them.  If you break the center, send
the gb cav around the stand of trees on the left side of the screen and
attack the lefternmost orcs from rear.

Like most of the missions, it requires a lot of luck and great deal of
skill to pull off.  You have to execute your moves almost flawlessly
and have the wind and sun to your back to boot.

If you don't, you'll end up getting chewed to death quite mercilessly.

-----

From: russ <[e-mail]>

Thanks for your post.  You're strategy sounds a little better than the
one I finally used.  What worked for me was to use the valley on the
far right as trap for the group of black orcs on the right.  The bait
was the black avengers (BA) who I placed back in the valley deeper than
the trees in the center, behind which I placed the Grudgebringer CAV
and Inf (GC and GI).  Their job was to pounce on the black orcs going
after the BA.  I placed my crossbows to the right of the clump of trees
on the left and next to them I placed Allor.  In the center I placed
Ceridan.  As soon as the battle opened up, the black orcs at the bottom
of the hill, started to advance up the hill towards the crossbows.  By
then, the dwarves had already got themselves surrounded and had routed
one group of ORCs.  I had Allor curse the black orcs advancing on the
crossbows and then I had crossbows and Allor pick them apart until they
routed and were wiped out.  The remaining set of orcs backing up the
now defunct black orcs on the left was then turned on by the crossbows,
Allor, and ultimately Ceridan when they got too close to the top of the
hill.  After several minutes they too were eliminated.  The dwarves,
having routed and damaged one group of orcs, took a severe beating at
the hand of combined ORC units and under fire from orc archers.  They
eventually routed and were severely beaten on their way off the map.
They fought a good holding battle for me.  I used them to buy time.

On the right,  the black orcs charged up the valley after the black
avengers, who held fast until the absolute last moment.  The Orcs then
seemed to pause, slightly, perhaps the AI realized that the GC and GI
were poised to stike at the orc rear, which they did simultaneously
with the black avengers frontal assault.  The result?  Black Orcs were
eliminated to a man.  No survivors.  I then moved the Black Avengers,
GC, and GI to the center and charged down the hill while the crossbows
held the orc archers at the foot of the hill at bay.  The Orc units at
the foot of the hill were not at full strength, as the dwarves had
severely mauled them.  The Black Avengers, GC, and GI crushed them one
at a time and then ran down and destoryed the orc archers.  The unit
guarding Carlsson's family was also eliminated quickly by these three
units.

My overall strategy was to use the dwarves as a deversion, and to crush
the powerful black orc units in the right and left as quickly as
possible, and to rely on magic and crossbows to slow other units
attempting to scale the hill to get me.  It may be questionable to let
the dwarves serve as cannon fodder, but at least it gave me the time to
overwhelm the more powerful ORC units by surprise.  I am sure the
dwarves are pissed off, but such are the fortunes of war.

-----

From: [e-mail] (Robin Kim)

Try to engage only at 2:1 odds if you can.  Keep your infantry
regiments close together for mutual support.  Use Curse of Anraheir on
one of the Black Orc regiments to slow them down.  They are your
biggest threat, and the longer you can postpone having to deal with at
least one of them, the better.

-----

From: [e-mail] (Nicholas John)

On this mission I used the above tactics but used the cavalry plus some
other regiment (Celidan..who's fast and doesn't die easily and is there
afterward even if he does, and maybe some other regiment too) to rollup
the left flank, hitting the biguns hard and fast.  I had 7 cavalry and
otherwise more or less full tho the Grudgebringers infantry were a
little low. The BA and GB infantry held the centre with the dwarves.  I
used the wizard as above (his spells are very important in this one)
but positioned him southish at first, and had to withdraw him as the
Black orcs and others closed...it was a necessary diversion of their
attention I think.  Oh yes..I also had to replay it many times to be
sure the dwarves didn't rout and to be sure that casualties were
minimal...the usual.

-----

From: [e-mail] (Nicholas John)

Use the mage to the SE to Curse one Black orc unit and decoy one doewn that
way, then move him back in near you other units. Don't worry about Ceridan..he
holds his own in H-H combat and can doo damage/cause routs if teamed witht he
cavalry (I had 7 left) in an attack on the left flank..then you can move in on
the other untis' flanks.  Some say to abandon the dwarves.  I found that
supporting them worked better for me.  There are other strategies, and i had
to try this one a couple of times before it worked well.

Worse lies ahead ;-)


Rescue Ilmarin =========================================================
--------------

From: [e-mail] (Ong Boon Hean)

Ok, main problem for me was the Rat Ogre guy b/c he kept chopping up my
melee troops, so deploy your crossbowmen and Alorr near him. Place the
infantry and calvary to defend against the Skaven troops which will
charge...When combat starts, curse the Rat Ogre and keep hitting him
with Amber Spears and crossbolts...When it finally kicks the bucket,
use the Calvary to slay the elite Skaven troops, and infantry +
crossbowmen against the others...With Alorr's help, you'll easily
dispatch the others.

-----

From: [e-mail] (Greyjack)

From what I recall, I found that telling Allor to start chucking spells
full-speed at the rat-ogre was what did it for me.  Once it was dead,
the rest of the enemy regiments fell pretty quickly.

To give a spellcaster that order, click on the spell button; when the
list of spells comes up, click the spell button _again_, then choose a
target.  The mage will then attack the target repeatedly with spells
(of his own choosing--in this case, he first cast the Curse of
Anraheir, followed by Hunting Spear over and over until it died),
pausing of course when he's out of spell points.


Shattered Pass =========================================================
--------------

From: [e-mail] (Karl Krieger)

Here is my solution, which however depends on your amber mages
experience. It's based on using the spell "Tangling Thorn", which
becomes accessible for him after the first 1000 experience points.

Place your two mortar units, which should be available at this time, in
the south east corner of the deploy area. In front of them just at the
eastern cliff position the crossbow men. Just for security, place the
Carlson guard in front of the mortars. If all goes well you won't need
them. Place the amber wiz at the north west corner of the deployment
area but make sure that he is not in the line of sight of the orc's
doomdivers. Place cavalry behind him (south) just in case...

Now let em come! DON't let the wiz cast anything else than "Tangling
Thorn".  You must direct the spells so that the foremost orc hordes
block the advance of the following. At the same time, use your mortar
units and the crossbow men to shred the pinned enemy to pieces. Again,
DON't let the wiz cast any other spell because he'll need all magic
energy for those Tangling Thorn spells.

The only monster coming through to my lines was the troll and he got
his ass kicked by the mad axemen (Ragnars Wolves) because their leader
got the sword of heroes with special abilities against big monsters in
an earlier mission.  After you have destroyed all advancing units that
way, use your cavalry to mop up the doom divers. It helps if they have
the shield of Ptolos to protect them from the remaining archers. You
can use the wizard to disturb these guys a bit until the cavalry is
ready to take care of them.  Ah, don't forget to switch off the AI of
the guard units. In my first attempt they happily charged toward the
pinned enemy and committed suicide :-)

-----

From: russ <[e-mail]>

I have beaten this scenario several times by putting my morters at the
very bottom of the ravine (side by side) where the setup is at the
start of the mission, and my cross bows to the right side along with
Allor.  The Cavalry units should be to the bottom left, next to the
morters as a qick response team.  In front of the morters, yet very
close to them should be all of your infantry units.  When the attack
comes the orcs will tend to pile up at the bend leading to the place
where your troops are.  Keep the morter and crossbows going.  Do not
assualt but attack only those units which get close enough to attack
your front line, when they do, hit them will ALL of your CAV and Inf.
This will rout them.  Use Allor to curse large groups so the morter can
destroy them.  I have completed this scenario several times this way
with only a few dead.  Try it.

-----

From: russ <[e-mail]>

It is winnable and here is how:
I have won this scenario every time this way.

Put your two morter sections at the bottom of the map, side by side, at
the bottom of the area where you set up.  The key is to use them to
cover the bend to the upper left of thier postions.  In the corner,
next to the morters, place the Cavalry, all of them that you have. In
front of the morters, and as close to them as possible, place your
infantry, and on the right side of the morters should be the crossbows
and Allor.  The key is to use Allor to curse and spear the oncoming orc
units, and while they bunch up at the bend to the left pound them with
the morters.  Your infantry and cavalry should be used to attack those
units which get close to your morters.  All units should hit
simultaniously on any orc units that get close to ensure a rout.

Try it!

-----

From: Vlad <email adress escaped my save proc.>

HEre's my strategy (note - any casualties are on my core units,
Carlsson's army is used as "orc meat"):  Put all Carlsson's units to
north edge of deployement area (about middle of it) with your Xbows and
mage. From your cavalry form line somewhere in middle of deployement
area (I use rock on left cliff as marker - about 5 lines of cav behind
it) and put your mortars behind it (it's good if at least one faces
nw). As the battle commence order mortars to destroy archers (with a
bit luck about 3rd hit should eliminate them, help them also with mage
and Xbows), then start bombarding comming units (once again mage and
xbows). Troll can either approach your cavalry - then try to burn him
with fireball, or just charge him (your personal cavalry should
eliminate him without any problems), or go after your mage, then use
Carlssons to get him. With Carlssons also stop orcs (you don't need to
destroy them , just stop them to make good targets for your mortars)
and run with mage and xbows (time to time send hunting spear or some
shafts to help Carlssons. Keep moratars firing into orcs - don't mind
if they will hit carlssons from time to time - they are not your units
:).  Just watch your mortars and if some is destroyed reload :(. After
you've successfuly eliminated orcs, wait for doomdivers to destroy
themselves (give them some bait behind rocks - they won't hit it and
with time destroy themselves). The last orc archers will come then.
Destroy them with mortars (or any other way as you wish as well). After
this just destroy wandering routed orcs with mage to get him some xps.

This plan relays heavily on mortars - if any of them is destroyed
reload (I reload anyway if any of my mortars is destroyed), if they
don't hit too much - reload. It takes some time but I've come to very
nice results with it  (no casualities on my side except Carlssons wiped
out)and mortar crews got about 1000 exps each :).


Escort Dwarves to Fortress =============================================
--------------------------

(this is the first Zhufbar mission)

From: "S. Patrick Gallaty" <[e-mail]>

Curse of Anrahir is the key.
Since the orc mage is mounted, the curse will break his will.  Then you
can run him down at your leisure.

I just found this one out - previously I had been suffering mightily at
the hands of this loser.


Grumm's Gate ===========================================================
------------

From: Huang Shze Jiun <[e-mail]>

I solved this problem by trapping the night goblins when they are
coming out the pass with a tangling thorns spell.  I then move my two
crossbow units, cavalry, and dwarf warriors to the north.  I have the
crossbowmen and allor whittle the wolf warriors as they circle around
the night goblins.  Then attack them with my cavalry and dwarf
warriors.  Important points are: Kill the wolf warriors completely,
Don't go too close to the night warriors to avoid fanatics.  Don't put
anybody in the path of the caravan. That is don't fight or leave any
units blocking the caravan.  Make sure the units you use are safely
inside or at least near the gate.  I manage to pass this mission losing
only the last horse and cart right behind the last mortar. Therefore I
did not lose any units.

-----

From: [e-mail] (Nan Wang)

Well, here's mine, it's not perfect, but it worked.

Try take as many regiments as possible, that will shorten the length of
the wagon train and reduce the chance of a bottleneck.  Your wagons will
travel on the left side, make sure you don't have some unit end up over
there.  Leave the dwarven warriors behind the trees in the middle of the
map and make sure they are facing down.  Move your range strikers forward
so they can strike the goblins coming down the pass.  Don't worry too much
about the frantics, most of the times they can't hit anything.  Use thorns/
flock of doom to kill/paralyze the wolf riders.  Meanwhile the gate should
be open and soon more greenskins appear.  Just move everybody inside the
gates, the newly appeared enemy should be pre-occuppied with the dwarven
warriors instead of give chase.

Come to think of it, I think I should have sacrificed the Black Avengers.
Those dwarven warriors are pretty nice.

-----

From: [e-mail] (Jez)

I had great difficulty with breaking into the Dwarven fortress, it is
more fiddly than anything else as you are up against the clock.

The way I did it seems to work quite well, as I only lost six archers.
Try to go through the gate guarded by orcs as the goblin wolf riders
are quicker. Take as few units as possible, as you want to save money.
The second reason for this is that the greenskin reinforcements arrive
after a certain proportion of the wagon train is in the gate, so, with
a long train, most of your army is safe before they arrive.

Okay, mechanics of it. I took all the cavalry, two units of crossbows,
Allor (very important) and no one else. These units dispose of the
guards as quickly as possible and then run for the gates. The Mercenary
crossbows and Allor now mount a rearguard action. Any riders that come
in to range get hit with the Curse, making their mounts flee so they
will not engage. Any units which don't flee should after one volley of
crossbows.

When I did this I lost half the Merc. crossbows (the price of a
rearguard) and no one else. I would not advise sacrificing whole units,
the Black Avengers do have their uses...

And for my next trick I will get past the Dragon without any losses..

P.S  Anyone who can't get past the dragon without loss, try this. Take
as few units as possible. Get All or to cast tangling thorn on the
dragon, he now cannot breath. The cavalry go past to get the orcs and
then run back down to the bottom. Allor gets rid of the spell on the
dragon and the orcs are toast. Recast the spell and finish the
mission....

-----

From: "S. Patrick Gallaty" <[e-mail]>

I used ceridan for this.

March him across so that the enemy appear (he didn't get hit by dragon
flames even when they landed on/around him).  Run him back to your own
side.

When the enemy come, those that manage to get past the flaming death
you charge with ceridan.  He holds up the train while the dragon burns
them to a crispy.  Even better, when they break he runs the confused
remains down.  Works best if you return him to your side of the dragon
alley when the enemy units are in disarray.  That way you can use him
to hold up another wave.

Tangling thorn and curse of anrahir are both very useful here.
Anything that slows down the advance of the enemy helps you.

On my side I kept the GB cav and the amber mage only - the dwarves I
got from the dwarven king.

Good luck!


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